I am Leo Cardillo, Treasurer, 711 Investment Club. Our Club has 25 members, about $450K in assets and has been in existence since 1955. Legend has it that the Club has never missed a monthly meeting. I know that we have not missed one in the 12 years that I have been in the Club.
Like all of you, this is a busy time of year for our Club. Thanks to Bivio, our Club taxes are completed and will be filed on time! Amen!
I have just joined this discussion and I want to briefly say that to the best of my knowledge our Club has never charged an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee. Members join with an Initial Investment equal to the Average Member Share and generally stay until their health prevents further participation. Monthly dues are collected, mostly by Direct Deposit to Fidelity, without issue or any sort of Fee. When a Member withdraws from the Club, the Member is given a cash payment equal to 100% of their holdings in the Club.
I realize that other Clubs may have to manage other considerations, but, as Treasurer, I would never support an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee for our Club.
Our club had the 3% fee for full withdrawal
in the by-laws. I was new to the club so did not have much at stake.
When I became Treasurer I pointed out that the 3% rule was not fair
to long time members. As a club you want members to stay with the
club for many years but we all know that things can change in your life
that might not make it possible to continue with the investment club, examples:
retire and move to another state, health reasons, job changes and many
others. The investment club is where we go learn how to invest
in an open fair and friendly setting.
We had 3 members that had been with
the club form the beginning and were moving on, one wanted to travel and
see his grand children more and the others were for medical reasons.
It did not seem fair the the new members would see that 3% as their gains
without doing anything. Also if new members were never recruited
the last member would receive all of the funds that were left.
Interesting to hear of these Initiation and Withdrawal
fees. I'm in the DC Regional Model Club. It is my 5th Investment Club and
I have never heard of these fees before this. I've never seen a reason
for fees in any of the clubs to which I have belonged, except for late
fees when dues are very late, but with direct payment to the brokerage
for every member now even that is no longer necessary.
Do other clubs have these fees and why?
Phyllis Woodring
Do what you can. Want what you
have. Be who you are.
On Sun, Mar 5, 2017 at 1:56 PM, Jeanne Tieken <jeannetieken@gmail.com>
wrote:
Our $50 initiation fee pays for the software each year.
Our 5% (voluntary withdrawal-no fee for death) discourages using the club
as a savings account. We're all elderly seniors and have a high turnover.
I am having difficulty completing the process of withdrawing
a member. This is a full withdrawal to which our particular club only gives
back 97% of the value of the stock. Additionally, we do not reimburse the
$75 initiation fee nor late payment fees which have been asses to this
member. I have tried several times to do this and do not get the right
amount. I can deduct the $115 fee and that comes off the total valuation
of the stock for that day but, it subtracts that from the total valuation
and not the 97% required by our club. Help!
Norma Wochna on
Our club has a $100 initiation fee which funds our petty cash account for paying our bivio and club dues and mailing costs for tax forms. If we have no new members we make a contribution to the petty cash fund to cover expenses. The initiation amounts are posted to fees. The petty cash replenishment is posted as an additional investment to the club and all members have to contribute. Our expenses are minimal so our petty cash is usually under $100.
I am Leo Cardillo, Treasurer, 711 Investment Club. Our Club has 25 members, about $450K in assets and has been in existence since 1955. Legend has it that the Club has never missed a monthly meeting. I know that we have not missed one in the 12 years that I have been in the Club.
Like all of you, this is a busy time of year for our Club. Thanks to Bivio, our Club taxes are completed and will be filed on time! Amen!
I have just joined this discussion and I want to briefly say that to the best of my knowledge our Club has never charged an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee. Members join with an Initial Investment equal to the Average Member Share and generally stay until their health prevents further participation. Monthly dues are collected, mostly by Direct Deposit to Fidelity, without issue or any sort of Fee. When a Member withdraws from the Club, the Member is given a cash payment equal to 100% of their holdings in the Club.
I realize that other Clubs may have to manage other considerations, but, as Treasurer, I would never support an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee for our Club.
Our club had the 3% fee for full withdrawal
in the by-laws. I was new to the club so did not have much at stake.
When I became Treasurer I pointed out that the 3% rule was not fair
to long time members. As a club you want members to stay with the
club for many years but we all know that things can change in your life
that might not make it possible to continue with the investment club, examples:
retire and move to another state, health reasons, job changes and many
others. The investment club is where we go learn how to invest
in an open fair and friendly setting.
We had 3 members that had been with
the club form the beginning and were moving on, one wanted to travel and
see his grand children more and the others were for medical reasons.
It did not seem fair the the new members would see that 3% as their gains
without doing anything. Also if new members were never recruited
the last member would receive all of the funds that were left.
Interesting to hear of these Initiation and Withdrawal
fees. I'm in the DC Regional Model Club. It is my 5th Investment Club and
I have never heard of these fees before this. I've never seen a reason
for fees in any of the clubs to which I have belonged, except for late
fees when dues are very late, but with direct payment to the brokerage
for every member now even that is no longer necessary.
Do other clubs have these fees and why?
Phyllis Woodring
Do what you can. Want what you
have. Be who you are.
On Sun, Mar 5, 2017 at 1:56 PM, Jeanne Tieken <jeannetieken@gmail.com>
wrote:
Our $50 initiation fee pays for the software each year.
Our 5% (voluntary withdrawal-no fee for death) discourages using the club
as a savings account. We're all elderly seniors and have a high turnover.
I am having difficulty completing the process of withdrawing
a member. This is a full withdrawal to which our particular club only gives
back 97% of the value of the stock. Additionally, we do not reimburse the
$75 initiation fee nor late payment fees which have been asses to this
member. I have tried several times to do this and do not get the right
amount. I can deduct the $115 fee and that comes off the total valuation
of the stock for that day but, it subtracts that from the total valuation
and not the 97% required by our club. Help!
Linda Glein on
Given that the accounting and mailing expenses are legitimate deductible expenses, why pay them out of petty cash. I thought petty cash was meant for non-deductible expenses, such as, 'we want to buy donuts and coffee' for the meeting, or a card and flowers for a sick member.
Our club has a $100 initiation fee which funds our petty cash account for paying our bivio and club dues and mailing costs for tax forms. If we have no new members we make a contribution to the petty cash fund to cover expenses. The initiation amounts are posted to fees. The petty cash replenishment is posted as an additional investment to the club and all members have to contribute. Our expenses are minimal so our petty cash is usually under $100.
I am Leo Cardillo, Treasurer, 711 Investment Club. Our Club has 25 members, about $450K in assets and has been in existence since 1955. Legend has it that the Club has never missed a monthly meeting. I know that we have not missed one in the 12 years that I have been in the Club.
Like all of you, this is a busy time of year for our Club. Thanks to Bivio, our Club taxes are completed and will be filed on time! Amen!
I have just joined this discussion and I want to briefly say that to the best of my knowledge our Club has never charged an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee. Members join with an Initial Investment equal to the Average Member Share and generally stay until their health prevents further participation. Monthly dues are collected, mostly by Direct Deposit to Fidelity, without issue or any sort of Fee. When a Member withdraws from the Club, the Member is given a cash payment equal to 100% of their holdings in the Club.
I realize that other Clubs may have to manage other considerations, but, as Treasurer, I would never support an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee for our Club.
Our club had the 3% fee for full withdrawal
in the by-laws. I was new to the club so did not have much at stake.
When I became Treasurer I pointed out that the 3% rule was not fair
to long time members. As a club you want members to stay with the
club for many years but we all know that things can change in your life
that might not make it possible to continue with the investment club, examples:
retire and move to another state, health reasons, job changes and many
others. The investment club is where we go learn how to invest
in an open fair and friendly setting.
We had 3 members that had been with
the club form the beginning and were moving on, one wanted to travel and
see his grand children more and the others were for medical reasons.
It did not seem fair the the new members would see that 3% as their gains
without doing anything. Also if new members were never recruited
the last member would receive all of the funds that were left.
Interesting to hear of these Initiation and Withdrawal
fees. I'm in the DC Regional Model Club. It is my 5th Investment Club and
I have never heard of these fees before this. I've never seen a reason
for fees in any of the clubs to which I have belonged, except for late
fees when dues are very late, but with direct payment to the brokerage
for every member now even that is no longer necessary.
Do other clubs have these fees and why?
Phyllis Woodring
Do what you can. Want what you
have. Be who you are.
On Sun, Mar 5, 2017 at 1:56 PM, Jeanne Tieken <jeannetieken@gmail.com>
wrote:
Our $50 initiation fee pays for the software each year.
Our 5% (voluntary withdrawal-no fee for death) discourages using the club
as a savings account. We're all elderly seniors and have a high turnover.
I am having difficulty completing the process of withdrawing
a member. This is a full withdrawal to which our particular club only gives
back 97% of the value of the stock. Additionally, we do not reimburse the
$75 initiation fee nor late payment fees which have been asses to this
member. I have tried several times to do this and do not get the right
amount. I can deduct the $115 fee and that comes off the total valuation
of the stock for that day but, it subtracts that from the total valuation
and not the 97% required by our club. Help!
rice.j1969 on
Ouch Norma! $100. So you use new people to pay for your club expenses. When we formed our club and added up all of the non-trading expenses for the year it came to about $25 for each partner. So when someone wanted to join within a few months of us started we decided that they should also pay the $25 since they are receiving the same benefit that we are. The $25 fee has been charged ever since. We also transfer $25 each month into another account to pay for all of the club expenses for the year.
John
On Monday, March 6, 2017 9:28 AM, Norma Wochna <jean.wochna@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Our club has a $100 initiation fee which funds our petty cash account for paying our bivio and club dues and mailing costs for tax forms. If we have no new members we make a contribution to the petty cash fund to cover expenses. The initiation amounts are posted to fees. The petty cash replenishment is posted as an additional investment to the club and all members have to contribute. Our expenses are minimal so our petty cash is usually under $100.
I am Leo Cardillo, Treasurer, 711 Investment Club. Our Club has 25 members, about $450K in assets and has been in existence since 1955. Legend has it that the Club has never missed a monthly meeting. I know that we have not missed one in the 12 years that I have been in the Club.
Like all of you, this is a busy time of year for our Club. Thanks to Bivio, our Club taxes are completed and will be filed on time! Amen!
I have just joined this discussion and I want to briefly say that to the best of my knowledge our Club has never charged an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee. Members join with an Initial Investment equal to the Average Member Share and generally stay until their health prevents further participation. Monthly dues are collected, mostly by Direct Deposit to Fidelity, without issue or any sort of Fee. When a Member withdraws from the Club, the Member is given a cash payment equal to 100% of their holdings in the Club.
I realize that other Clubs may have to manage other considerations, but, as Treasurer, I would never support an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee for our Club.
Our club had the 3% fee for full withdrawal
in the by-laws. I was new to the club so did not have much at stake.
When I became Treasurer I pointed out that the 3% rule was not fair
to long time members. As a club you want members to stay with the
club for many years but we all know that things can change in your life
that might not make it possible to continue with the investment club, examples:
retire and move to another state, health reasons, job changes and many
others. The investment club is where we go learn how to invest
in an open fair and friendly setting.
We had 3 members that had been with
the club form the beginning and were moving on, one wanted to travel and
see his grand children more and the others were for medical reasons.
It did not seem fair the the new members would see that 3% as their gains
without doing anything. Also if new members were never recruited
the last member would receive all of the funds that were left.
Interesting to hear of these Initiation and Withdrawal
fees. I'm in the DC Regional Model Club. It is my 5th Investment Club and
I have never heard of these fees before this. I've never seen a reason
for fees in any of the clubs to which I have belonged, except for late
fees when dues are very late, but with direct payment to the brokerage
for every member now even that is no longer necessary.
Do other clubs have these fees and why?
Phyllis Woodring
Do what you can. Want what you
have. Be who you are.
On Sun, Mar 5, 2017 at 1:56 PM, Jeanne Tieken <jeannetieken@gmail.com>
wrote:
Our $50 initiation fee pays for the software each year.
Our 5% (voluntary withdrawal-no fee for death) discourages using the club
as a savings account. We're all elderly seniors and have a high turnover.
I am having difficulty completing the process of withdrawing
a member. This is a full withdrawal to which our particular club only gives
back 97% of the value of the stock. Additionally, we do not reimburse the
$75 initiation fee nor late payment fees which have been asses to this
member. I have tried several times to do this and do not get the right
amount. I can deduct the $115 fee and that comes off the total valuation
of the stock for that day but, it subtracts that from the total valuation
and not the 97% required by our club. Help!
Dick Lewis on
We keep it simple...... Member payments (monthly dues) goes into one
bucket. All expenses (business and non business) come out of the same
bucket. No need to mess with petty cash.
Our club has a $100 initiation fee which funds our petty cash account for
paying our bivio and club dues and mailing costs for tax forms. If we have no
new members we make a contribution to the petty cash fund to cover expenses. The
initiation amounts are posted to fees. The petty cash replenishment is posted as
an additional investment to the club and all members have to contribute. Our
expenses are minimal so our petty cash is usually under $100.
I am Leo Cardillo,
Treasurer, 711 Investment Club. Our Club has 25 members, about $450K in assets
and has been in existence since 1955. Legend has it that the Club has never
missed a monthly meeting. I know that we have not missed one in the 12 years
that I have been in the Club.
Like all of you, this is a
busy time of year for our Club. Thanks to Bivio, our Club taxes are completed
and will be filed on time! Amen!
I have just joined this
discussion and I want to briefly say that to the best of my knowledge our Club
has never charged an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee. Members join with an
Initial Investment equal to the Average Member Share and generally stay until
their health prevents further participation. Monthly dues are collected,
mostly by Direct Deposit to Fidelity, without issue or any sort of Fee. When a
Member withdraws from the Club, the Member is given a cash payment equal to
100% of their holdings in the Club.
I realize that other Clubs
may have to manage other considerations, but, as Treasurer, I would never
support an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee for our Club.
Our club had the 3% fee for full withdrawal in the
by-laws. I was new to the club so did not have much at
stake. When I became Treasurer I pointed out that the 3% rule
was not fair to long time members. As a club you want members to
stay with the club for many years but we all know that things can change in
your life that might not make it possible to continue with the investment
club, examples: retire and move to another state, health reasons, job
changes and many others. The investment club is where we
go learn how to invest in an open fair and friendly
setting.
We
had 3 members that had been with the club form the beginning and were moving
on, one wanted to travel and see his grand children more and the others were
for medical reasons. It did not seem fair the the new members
would see that 3% as their gains without doing anything. Also if
new members were never recruited the last member would receive all of the
funds that were left.
Interesting to hear of these Initiation and Withdrawal
fees. I'm in the DC Regional Model Club. It is my 5th Investment Club and I
have never heard of these fees before this. I've never seen a reason for
fees in any of the clubs to which I have belonged, except for late fees when
dues are very late, but with direct payment to the brokerage for every
member now even that is no longer necessary.
Do
other clubs have these fees and why? Phyllis
Woodring
Do what you
can. Want what you have. Be who you are.
On
Sun, Mar 5, 2017 at 1:56 PM, Jeanne Tieken <jeannetieken@gmail.com>
wrote: Our $50 initiation fee pays for the software
each year. Our 5% (voluntary withdrawal-no fee for death) discourages
using the club as a savings account. We're all elderly seniors and have a
high turnover.
I am having difficulty completing
the process of withdrawing a member. This is a full withdrawal to which our
particular club only gives back 97% of the value of the stock. Additionally,
we do not reimburse the $75 initiation fee nor late payment fees which have
been asses to this member. I have tried several times to do this and do not
get the right amount. I can deduct the $115 fee and that comes off the
total valuation of the stock for that day but, it subtracts that from the
total valuation and not the 97% required by our club. Help!
William C. Peterson on
Many years ago, when my first club was forming,
BetterInvesting (BI) offered a sample partnership agreement
which included a withdrawal fee (and may also have included
an initiation fee). Far many years, this sample partnership
agreement was used by new clubs as their own partnership
agreement. As time passed, however, people realized how
unfair these fees were to new and withdrawing partners, and
BI recommended that clubs change their partnership
agreements and by-laws to eliminate them. The Model club to
which I now belong charges no withdrawal fee, and the
initiation amount buys units for the new partner, so it's
not really a fee.
By the way, since club expenses are charged to members
proportionally to their percent of ownership in the club,
the club should pay only those expenses which are legitimate
deductions (software purchases and the club's BI membership
fee, for example). All other expenses should be paid
directly by the member who benefits from the expense. For
example, individual BI membership costs should be paid
directly by each member with a check written directly to BI.
The club Treasurer can collect these checks and mail them in
with the club's renewal form and the club's renewal fee.
Note that the club's renewal fee should be paid from club
funds as it benefits all members and is deductible.
rice.j1969 on
What do people mean by Model club? We don't use BetterInvesting so I don't know if it is one of their terms.
John
On Monday, March 6, 2017 1:48 PM, William C. Peterson <wmpeterson@cox.net> wrote:
Many years ago, when my first club was forming, BetterInvesting (BI) offered a sample partnership agreement which included a withdrawal fee (and may also have included an initiation fee). Far many years, this sample partnership agreement was used by new clubs as their own partnership agreement. As time passed, however, people realized how unfair these fees were to new and withdrawing partners, and BI recommended that clubs change their partnership agreements and by-laws to eliminate them. The Model club to which I now belong charges no withdrawal fee, and the initiation amount buys units for the new partner, so it's not really a fee. By the way, since club expenses are charged to members proportionally to their percent of ownership in the club, the club should pay only those expenses which are legitimate deductions (software purchases and the club's BI membership fee, for example). All other expenses should be paid directly by the member who benefits from the expense. For example, individual BI membership costs should be paid directly by each member with a check written directly to BI. The club Treasurer can collect these checks and mail them in with the club's renewal form and the club's renewal fee. Note that the club's renewal fee should be paid from club funds as it benefits all members and is deductible.
Dick Lewis on
Concerning expenses..... Bivio provides the flexibility to log expenses as
deductible or non deductible.... and ..... proportional or non
proportional. That should cover anything the club is doing. We
recently held a dinner where wives were honored with roses. The club paid
for those but the expense was logged as non business..... and non
proportional. So each member paid exactly the same, regardless of his
percentage ownership.
Many
years ago, when my first club was forming, BetterInvesting (BI) offered a
sample partnership agreement which included a withdrawal fee (and may also
have included an initiation fee). Far many years, this sample
partnership agreement was used by new clubs as their own
partnership agreement. As time passed, however, people realized how unfair
these fees were to new and withdrawing partners, and BI recommended that
clubs change their partnership agreements and by-laws to eliminate them. The
Model club to which I now belong charges no withdrawal fee, and
the initiation amount buys units for the new partner, so it's not really a
fee. By the way, since club expenses are charged to members proportionally
to their percent of ownership in the club, the club should pay only those
expenses which are legitimate deductions (software purchases and the club's
BI membership fee, for example). All other expenses should be
paid directly by the member who benefits from the expense. For example,
individual BI membership costs should be paid directly by each member with a
check written directly to BI. The club Treasurer can collect these checks and
mail them in with the club's renewal form and the club's renewal fee. Note
that the club's renewal fee should be paid from club funds as it benefits all
members and is deductible.
William C. Peterson on
While there is some debate as to what the exact
characteristics of a model club are, I would describe it as
follows:
1) The club is sponsored by some organization (e.g. a
chapter of BetterInvesting).
2) The club is operated using some sort of "best practices"
as defined by the sponsoring organization.
3) The club allows the general public to visit its meetings
to learn how the club operates.
4) The club allows both men and women to join.
5) Prospective members must be (or become) members of the
sponsoring organization.
William C. Peterson on
Thank you for reminding us of this capability of Bivio. I
would imagine that other club accounting packages also have
this capability. Nevertheless, it is still simpler for the
club treasurer not to have to enter such expenses at all,
and for the audit committee not to have to make certain that
they were allocated correctly. I wouldn't be surprised if
many club treasurers are unaware of the potential problems
that can arise at tax time if such expenses are entered
improperly, especially if the club accounts are audited by a
taxing authority.
cindy gerke on
Leo,
Just wondering why someone would invest $15K to 20 K to join a club to learn to invest. It would cost about $15K to join ours. We have $100 plus first month $20 dues for new member. New member allowed to increase dues but encouraged to open a private account and invest in stocks studied but club may not have funds or choose to invest at that time.
I am Leo Cardillo, Treasurer, 711 Investment Club. Our Club has 25 members, about $450K in assets and has been in existence since 1955. Legend has it that the Club has never missed a monthly meeting. I know that we have not missed one in the 12 years that I have been in the Club.
Like all of you, this is a busy time of year for our Club. Thanks to Bivio, our Club taxes are completed and will be filed on time! Amen!
I have just joined this discussion and I want to briefly say that to the best of my knowledge our Club has never charged an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee. Members join with an Initial Investment equal to the Average Member Share and generally stay until their health prevents further participation. Monthly dues are collected, mostly by Direct Deposit to Fidelity, without issue or any sort of Fee. When a Member withdraws from the Club, the Member is given a cash payment equal to 100% of their holdings in the Club.
I realize that other Clubs may have to manage other considerations, but, as Treasurer, I would never support an Initiation, Late or Withdrawal Fee for our Club.
Our club had the 3% fee for full withdrawal
in the by-laws. I was new to the club so did not have much at stake.
When I became Treasurer I pointed out that the 3% rule was not fair
to long time members. As a club you want members to stay with the
club for many years but we all know that things can change in your life
that might not make it possible to continue with the investment club, examples:
retire and move to another state, health reasons, job changes and many
others. The investment club is where we go learn how to invest
in an open fair and friendly setting.
We had 3 members that had been with
the club form the beginning and were moving on, one wanted to travel and
see his grand children more and the others were for medical reasons.
It did not seem fair the the new members would see that 3% as their gains
without doing anything. Also if new members were never recruited
the last member would receive all of the funds that were left.
Interesting to hear of these Initiation and Withdrawal
fees. I'm in the DC Regional Model Club. It is my 5th Investment Club and
I have never heard of these fees before this. I've never seen a reason
for fees in any of the clubs to which I have belonged, except for late
fees when dues are very late, but with direct payment to the brokerage
for every member now even that is no longer necessary.
Do other clubs have these fees and why?
Phyllis Woodring
Do what you can. Want what you
have. Be who you are.
On Sun, Mar 5, 2017 at 1:56 PM, Jeanne Tieken <jeannetieken@gmail.com>
wrote:
Our $50 initiation fee pays for the software each year.
Our 5% (voluntary withdrawal-no fee for death) discourages using the club
as a savings account. We're all elderly seniors and have a high turnover.
I am having difficulty completing the process of withdrawing
a member. This is a full withdrawal to which our particular club only gives
back 97% of the value of the stock. Additionally, we do not reimburse the
$75 initiation fee nor late payment fees which have been asses to this
member. I have tried several times to do this and do not get the right
amount. I can deduct the $115 fee and that comes off the total valuation
of the stock for that day but, it subtracts that from the total valuation
and not the 97% required by our club. Help!