2 Tax Questions
Dear Linda Wiltse/All:
I am joining this thread late, but our Club has 25 members and about $450,000 in assets and has been in existence for more than 60 years without a break of any kind. The Old Guys ( like me!) believe that we have never missed a monthly meeting - could be true! As Treasurer, I have used Bivio for some 8 years.
I prepare our annual tax return, after we have our Audit Party, in a very few minutes. Unless there are foreign tax issues or some unusual distribution, our tax return takes less than five minutes to prepare.
Bivio's tax program most certainly does account for different deposits/withdrawals by different members at different times. You must, of course, select the time-based option in the tax program set-up.
The K-1's are prepared automatically for each member - there is no manual input of data required, with the possible exception of correcting a name spelling, SSN or street address. Even those are one-time events.
There are no issues with rounding errors. None.
I do file a paper return, but it is fairly simple and easy and consists of about 30 pages ( there are 25 K-1's as part of that count of 30 pages).
I am not a CPA or any kind of Accountant, but it does seem as you are creating a huge amount of unnecessary and, perhaps, error-prone, tax work that is simlply not required.
Hope this helps.
Best regards,
Leo Cardillo
Treasurer, 711 Investment Club
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On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 3:23 PM, byrdshot <byrdshot@ameritech.net> wrote:
I don't understand why you think you can't send a paper return to the IRS? What makes you think that? The amount of work you're talking about is just unbelievable.Kim PotterBI Brighton (MI)Sent via the Samsung Galaxy Tab E, an AT&T 4G LTE tablet-------- Original message --------From: Linda Wiltse <wiltse@optonline.net>Date: 1/26/17 1:53 PM (GMT-05:00)Subject: RE: [club_cafe] 2 Tax QuestionsWe have a large club. I do not feel comfortable mailing out the tax return which is a lot of paper. Some states do not even allow filing on paper. I spent over 40 hours entering all Bivio's information into my tax program at work. A smaller club would not take that long. The tax program is not capable of allocating information to the partners because everyone puts in different amounts at different times, so I need to enter the tax info, and then manually enter the info from all the K-1's. I can never get it to match exactly due to rounding issues, but a dollar or two here or there is not a big issue. I file the return electronically, but I put us on extension because I cannot get it all done during tax season.
If you go to a tax preparer to E-file, they are going to charge a lot, depending on the size of the club, because it is a lot of work.
I am sure it would cost Bivio a lot to become a participant in E-file because of the extra programming it would entail. The problem is, the IRS and states do not want paper returns anymore and can decide to penalize people who don't e-file.
Linda Wiltse
From: club_cafe@bivio.com [mailto:club_cafe@bivio.com] On Behalf Of ira smilovitz
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2017 9:38 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] 2 Tax Questions
If you receive a corrected broker statement, you file an amended 1065 (Form 1065X).
While it is possible to file a partnership return electronically, bivio is not an authorized electronic return originator (ERO), developer, or transmitter. The rules for participation in IRS MeF (Modernized e-File) are very different from those to generate substitute paper forms.
Ira Smilovitz, EA
On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 9:03 AM, Gayle Freeman via bivio.com <user*30100001@bivio.com> wrote:
1. What happens after filing Mar 15th if we received a corrected broker statement?
2. Can we file electronically? If so, How?
Thank your, Gayle Freeman
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If I want to e-file the return, I must use software to prepare the return to be e-filed. I must manually enter the information that Bivio provides because the tax program cannot calculate the tax allocations for each member. The first few years of our club, the IRS tried to fine us for not filing a tax return. The return was prepared by Bivio and K-1's issued, but the IRS claims they never received the returns. I was not in the club at the time, so we could not figure out if the person in charge ever mailed in the tax return. E-filing is the only way to insure that the tax return is filed and leave us with proof of filing.
Do I have to spend the time doing this? - NO, but I choose to do it. I am a tax preparer so I know how to do it correctly.
Linda Wiltse
From: club_cafe@bivio.com [mailto:club_cafe@bivio.com] On Behalf Of Martina Tse
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2017 5:02 PM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] 2 Tax Questions
Hi, would you please take me off the email list as most topics are info I do not need.
Thanks,
Martina
On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 3:30 PM, Leo Cardillo <leofcardillo@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Linda Wiltse/All:
I am joining this thread late, but our Club has 25 members and about $450,000 in assets and has been in existence for more than 60 years without a break of any kind. The Old Guys ( like me!) believe that we have never missed a monthly meeting - could be true! As Treasurer, I have used Bivio for some 8 years.
I prepare our annual tax return, after we have our Audit Party, in a very few minutes. Unless there are foreign tax issues or some unusual distribution, our tax return takes less than five minutes to prepare.
Bivio's tax program most certainly does account for different deposits/withdrawals by different members at different times. You must, of course, select the time-based option in the tax program set-up.
The K-1's are prepared automatically for each member - there is no manual input of data required, with the possible exception of correcting a name spelling, SSN or street address. Even those are one-time events.
There are no issues with rounding errors. None.
I do file a paper return, but it is fairly simple and easy and consists of about 30 pages ( there are 25 K-1's as part of that count of 30 pages).
I am not a CPA or any kind of Accountant, but it does seem as you are creating a huge amount of unnecessary and, perhaps, error-prone, tax work that is simlply not required.
Hope this helps.
Best regards,
Leo Cardillo
Treasurer, 711 Investment Club
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 3:23 PM, byrdshot <byrdshot@ameritech.net> wrote:
I don't understand why you think you can't send a paper return to the IRS? What makes you think that? The amount of work you're talking about is just unbelievable.
Kim Potter
BI Brighton (MI)
Sent via the Samsung Galaxy Tab E, an AT&T 4G LTE tablet
-------- Original message --------
From: Linda Wiltse <wiltse@optonline.net>
Date: 1/26/17 1:53 PM (GMT-05:00)
Subject: RE: [club_cafe] 2 Tax Questions
We have a large club. I do not feel comfortable mailing out the tax return which is a lot of paper. Some states do not even allow filing on paper. I spent over 40 hours entering all Bivio's information into my tax program at work. A smaller club would not take that long. The tax program is not capable of allocating information to the partners because everyone puts in different amounts at different times, so I need to enter the tax info, and then manually enter the info from all the K-1's. I can never get it to match exactly due to rounding issues, but a dollar or two here or there is not a big issue. I file the return electronically, but I put us on extension because I cannot get it all done during tax season.
If you go to a tax preparer to E-file, they are going to charge a lot, depending on the size of the club, because it is a lot of work.
I am sure it would cost Bivio a lot to become a participant in E-file because of the extra programming it would entail. The problem is, the IRS and states do not want paper returns anymore and can decide to penalize people who don't e-file.
Linda Wiltse
From: club_cafe@bivio.com [mailto:club_cafe@bivio.com] On Behalf Of ira smilovitz
Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2017 9:38 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] 2 Tax Questions
If you receive a corrected broker statement, you file an amended 1065 (Form 1065X).
While it is possible to file a partnership return electronically, bivio is not an authorized electronic return originator (ERO), developer, or transmitter. The rules for participation in IRS MeF (Modernized e-File) are very different from those to generate substitute paper forms.
Ira Smilovitz, EA
On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 9:03 AM, Gayle Freeman via bivio.com <user*30100001@bivio.com> wrote:
1. What happens after filing Mar 15th if we received a corrected broker statement?
2. Can we file electronically? If so, How?
Thank your, Gayle Freeman
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On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 8:22 PM, Linda Wiltse <wiltse@optonline.net> wrote:
E-filing is the only way to insure that the tax return is filed and leave us with proof of filing.
Our treasurer sent the filing in via Registered mail Return Receipt. That seemed to be proof enough.
Linda